Women have risen hugely in TV and movies in the last ten years, as much off-screen as on it. So the patterns in the above research are likely to have changed a lot. You can see something similar in popular music, although producers and industry still tilt male.
Anyway I just watched “Masters of the Air”, a WW2 drama made for men by men and I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed it. There were about three women with speaking parts and they were all love interests.
Old Yiddish joke – A man tells his friend ” Yankel, I have no mazel(luck), I had a brilliant idea to train my horse not to eat . I gave him less and less to eat every week and just when I was at the brink of success he up and keeled over.”
Steve, to be honest at the risk of being sexist, for me personally there is no actress alive today or even during the Golden Era of Hollywood who I would pay to see in a movie at the local theater. When I watch a movie, I prefer to see the likes of actors such as Clark Gable, John Wayne, Jimmy Stewart, Cary Grant, Bogart, Eastwood, George C. Scott, Gene Hackman, etc, etc. (Yes, I love old films.) I haven't paid to see a movie at the local theater in a very long time. Maybe it's a male thing, but I imagine there are lots of others who share this view. That's just my opinion, of course. Enjoyed the article.
It would be easy to cut the female characters from Shakespeare’s Henry tetralogy (Richard II/Henry IV 1 and 2/Henry V). But as Shakespeare matures as a dramatic artist he seems to strive to create more balance between male and female perspectives (eg contrast Julius Caesar with Coriolanus). Similarly the all-male war/crime/western movie (perhaps beginning with Lawrence of Arabia in 1960) seems like a function of greater desire for realism after the Golden Age of Hollywood: eg “Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid” but not any John Ford westerns. Golden Age Hollywood sought to cater to both sexes more.
Right, mid-Century Hollywood's bigger budget products were aimed at both sexes. Gone With the Wind started off with George Cukor, the leading women's picture director, in charge. But Clark Gable got him fired and his buddy Victor Fleming hired to beef up the Rhett Butler role, which worked out very well in the end.
Cukor filmed all the feminine parts of "Gone With the Wind" and Fleming got to film the masculine parts. Cukor resented Gable for getting him fired until Cukor's own death and liked dropping hints that Gable dabbled in homosexual Hollywood before Gable became a star. Gable was dead when Cukor made his accusations which Gable could not refute due his being a buried corpse.
I'm not up on the newer films, but in the long past many of the top genres were male-dominated. War films. Westerns. Action films. Crime films. Comedies. Some of the finest films of the long past had virtually no female characters. Captains Courageous. Breaker Morant. Twelve O'Clock High. Stalag 17. Bridge on the River Kwai. Red River, albeit Joanne Dru plays an important role after entering the film two-thirds the way through. Even in classics like The Searchers and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, men do at least 80 % of the speaking while Vera Miles has almost all the female speaking parts. Rocky is male-dominated except for the romantic role of Talia Shire.
The screwball comedies of the 30s had scripts where women and men had equal speaking roles. It was the heyday of Claudette Colbert, Jean Arthur and Carole Lombard who were more than equal to the challenge of acting with formidable male actors and were vital to the comedies. In Holiday and The Philadelphia Story, men and women have equal speaking parts. Both were directed by homosexual George Cukor and starred Katherine Hepburn and Cary Grant.
My best man's movie with 2 women whose parts are the glue that sticks the whole script together: "Red River" John Wayne, Montgomery Clift and Walter Brennan. The two women's parts are played by Coleen Gray & Joanne Dru. The women don't have much dialogue but they sell every syllable of every line they say and to this day I'm in love with them both. Hollywood.
A member of my family moved to Hollywood to be an actress. She landed a number of small parts in TV shows and some work as an extra in features, but could never make a living at it, so after a few years she went back to school and became an occupational therapist focusing on helping first time mothers adjust to the demands of their new role. She married a movie producer, whom she finds to be a fine husband and a great dad to their daughter. When they first got together, her friends all asked her if she would revive her acting career by appearing in his movies, to which she would reply, "Have you SEEN his movies?" She thinks it's wonderful he enjoys his work and is proud of his success, but that part of his life is strictly Guy Stuff as far as she is concerned, and she is very happy not being part of it.
Presumably going back another 20 years would only embellish this argument. Laurence of Arabia I think contains no spoken part by a woman, and then there is the Godfather I and II, the Deerhunter, etc.
Up until the day before yesterday, if a person wanted to make a realistic war movie, prison movie, Western, or crime movie (the latter two to a lesser extent), then it was going to be all-male. Since these have been among the most popular genres historically, it makes sense that they would also be among the both the best movies and the common commonly made.
And, up until the day before yesterday, romantic tragedies, romantic comedies, and screwball comedies (to a lesser extent) have, by moral necessity, been movies with both men and women (thank God).
Women are attracted to men based on what they say and do. Men are attracted to women based on how they look and...uh...
We go to movies, even action movies, (no homo) to fall in love.
One of my favorite re-watchable movies of (I was about to write 'recent years' then realized I'm old) is "Almost Famous". At its heart is the story of a woman desired by two very different men, yet most of the interesting dialogue and action is of and by the men.
I think this is even how the average woman prefers to take in the story. The one man demonstrates how he is a sexy cool cad of a rock star with far less substance than he thinks, while the other shows his less flashy talent and promising future while being too young and un-cool, more of a friend vibe who doesn't understand he has no chance with such a goddess .
The girl is quiet and mysterious (thus little dialogue)...not the most classically beautiful but somehow has a quality that drives men mad. That quality is never going to be witty dialogue
WOW! Jumping Jack Flash. I'd thought I would have killed those brain cells from the 80's buy now. Whoopi Goldberg as a CIA computer specialist? Man the 80's were funny.
I am old enough to remember certain movie theaters in neighborhoods populated by confirmed bachelors would put "All Mele Cast" on the marquee.
I immediately thought of Full Metal Jacket as my choice, then I remembered the two unfortunate ladies in the film..."Too boko" indeed.
Almost no female lines but the ones that were, resonated! Inspired song!
ooo me so hawny! Me love you long time!
Poetry
I'd forgotten that one...Joker's martial arts dazzled me
Women have risen hugely in TV and movies in the last ten years, as much off-screen as on it. So the patterns in the above research are likely to have changed a lot. You can see something similar in popular music, although producers and industry still tilt male.
Anyway I just watched “Masters of the Air”, a WW2 drama made for men by men and I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed it. There were about three women with speaking parts and they were all love interests.
Too bad box office dropped dramatically over the last ten years.
20th Century Guys like me you and me like two-hour movies and the written word but culture is all short-form video now.
Old Yiddish joke – A man tells his friend ” Yankel, I have no mazel(luck), I had a brilliant idea to train my horse not to eat . I gave him less and less to eat every week and just when I was at the brink of success he up and keeled over.”
Steve, to be honest at the risk of being sexist, for me personally there is no actress alive today or even during the Golden Era of Hollywood who I would pay to see in a movie at the local theater. When I watch a movie, I prefer to see the likes of actors such as Clark Gable, John Wayne, Jimmy Stewart, Cary Grant, Bogart, Eastwood, George C. Scott, Gene Hackman, etc, etc. (Yes, I love old films.) I haven't paid to see a movie at the local theater in a very long time. Maybe it's a male thing, but I imagine there are lots of others who share this view. That's just my opinion, of course. Enjoyed the article.
It would be easy to cut the female characters from Shakespeare’s Henry tetralogy (Richard II/Henry IV 1 and 2/Henry V). But as Shakespeare matures as a dramatic artist he seems to strive to create more balance between male and female perspectives (eg contrast Julius Caesar with Coriolanus). Similarly the all-male war/crime/western movie (perhaps beginning with Lawrence of Arabia in 1960) seems like a function of greater desire for realism after the Golden Age of Hollywood: eg “Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid” but not any John Ford westerns. Golden Age Hollywood sought to cater to both sexes more.
Henry VI: Margaret!
Right, mid-Century Hollywood's bigger budget products were aimed at both sexes. Gone With the Wind started off with George Cukor, the leading women's picture director, in charge. But Clark Gable got him fired and his buddy Victor Fleming hired to beef up the Rhett Butler role, which worked out very well in the end.
Cukor filmed all the feminine parts of "Gone With the Wind" and Fleming got to film the masculine parts. Cukor resented Gable for getting him fired until Cukor's own death and liked dropping hints that Gable dabbled in homosexual Hollywood before Gable became a star. Gable was dead when Cukor made his accusations which Gable could not refute due his being a buried corpse.
I'm not up on the newer films, but in the long past many of the top genres were male-dominated. War films. Westerns. Action films. Crime films. Comedies. Some of the finest films of the long past had virtually no female characters. Captains Courageous. Breaker Morant. Twelve O'Clock High. Stalag 17. Bridge on the River Kwai. Red River, albeit Joanne Dru plays an important role after entering the film two-thirds the way through. Even in classics like The Searchers and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, men do at least 80 % of the speaking while Vera Miles has almost all the female speaking parts. Rocky is male-dominated except for the romantic role of Talia Shire.
The screwball comedies of the 30s had scripts where women and men had equal speaking roles. It was the heyday of Claudette Colbert, Jean Arthur and Carole Lombard who were more than equal to the challenge of acting with formidable male actors and were vital to the comedies. In Holiday and The Philadelphia Story, men and women have equal speaking parts. Both were directed by homosexual George Cukor and starred Katherine Hepburn and Cary Grant.
My best man's movie with 2 women whose parts are the glue that sticks the whole script together: "Red River" John Wayne, Montgomery Clift and Walter Brennan. The two women's parts are played by Coleen Gray & Joanne Dru. The women don't have much dialogue but they sell every syllable of every line they say and to this day I'm in love with them both. Hollywood.
A member of my family moved to Hollywood to be an actress. She landed a number of small parts in TV shows and some work as an extra in features, but could never make a living at it, so after a few years she went back to school and became an occupational therapist focusing on helping first time mothers adjust to the demands of their new role. She married a movie producer, whom she finds to be a fine husband and a great dad to their daughter. When they first got together, her friends all asked her if she would revive her acting career by appearing in his movies, to which she would reply, "Have you SEEN his movies?" She thinks it's wonderful he enjoys his work and is proud of his success, but that part of his life is strictly Guy Stuff as far as she is concerned, and she is very happy not being part of it.
I love Bogey but Bergman stole my heart in Casablanca. Don't data nerds realize a picture is worth a thousand words.
Presumably going back another 20 years would only embellish this argument. Laurence of Arabia I think contains no spoken part by a woman, and then there is the Godfather I and II, the Deerhunter, etc.
The Arab women ululate when the men ride out toward Aqaba. That's it for women in "Lawrence of Arabia."
Of course, Lawrence was gay so that played a role too in their not being any women in his biopic.
Up until the day before yesterday, if a person wanted to make a realistic war movie, prison movie, Western, or crime movie (the latter two to a lesser extent), then it was going to be all-male. Since these have been among the most popular genres historically, it makes sense that they would also be among the both the best movies and the common commonly made.
And, up until the day before yesterday, romantic tragedies, romantic comedies, and screwball comedies (to a lesser extent) have, by moral necessity, been movies with both men and women (thank God).
Women are attracted to men based on what they say and do. Men are attracted to women based on how they look and...uh...
We go to movies, even action movies, (no homo) to fall in love.
One of my favorite re-watchable movies of (I was about to write 'recent years' then realized I'm old) is "Almost Famous". At its heart is the story of a woman desired by two very different men, yet most of the interesting dialogue and action is of and by the men.
I think this is even how the average woman prefers to take in the story. The one man demonstrates how he is a sexy cool cad of a rock star with far less substance than he thinks, while the other shows his less flashy talent and promising future while being too young and un-cool, more of a friend vibe who doesn't understand he has no chance with such a goddess .
The girl is quiet and mysterious (thus little dialogue)...not the most classically beautiful but somehow has a quality that drives men mad. That quality is never going to be witty dialogue
You're overthinking this one, Steve. People won't pay for stuff they already get plenty of for free.
WOW! Jumping Jack Flash. I'd thought I would have killed those brain cells from the 80's buy now. Whoopi Goldberg as a CIA computer specialist? Man the 80's were funny.
"Whoopi Goldberg as a CIA computer specialist? Man the 80's were funny."
Considering the success the CIA has enjoyed the last couple of decades, perhaps there's something to it?
90's- Goldberg as a homicide detective in The Player.